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	<title>Comments on: What once was</title>
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	<link>http://loteriachicana.net/2009/11/19/what-once-was</link>
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		<title>By: Caleb</title>
		<link>http://loteriachicana.net/2009/11/19/what-once-was/comment-page-1#comment-101747</link>
		<dc:creator>Caleb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Sep 2011 06:40:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://loteriachicana.net/?p=1292#comment-101747</guid>
		<description>I really like your blog and there are some interesting points made. There are so many sites out there which are badly presented that it&#039;s a pleasant suprise to find a good one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really like your blog and there are some interesting points made. There are so many sites out there which are badly presented that it&#8217;s a pleasant suprise to find a good one.</p>
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		<title>By: cindylu</title>
		<link>http://loteriachicana.net/2009/11/19/what-once-was/comment-page-1#comment-74223</link>
		<dc:creator>cindylu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 21:49:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://loteriachicana.net/?p=1292#comment-74223</guid>
		<description>ERH,
It&#039;s interesting how much the state invested in public programs and services when the state was a lot more white. Now that it&#039;s become much more diverse, they&#039;re rolling back on those programs. 

Steve,
Anytime, primo. Sometimes I can get all egghead when it comes to these things.

HP,
I should start limiting your comments to 200 words.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ERH,<br />
It&#8217;s interesting how much the state invested in public programs and services when the state was a lot more white. Now that it&#8217;s become much more diverse, they&#8217;re rolling back on those programs. </p>
<p>Steve,<br />
Anytime, primo. Sometimes I can get all egghead when it comes to these things.</p>
<p>HP,<br />
I should start limiting your comments to 200 words.</p>
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		<title>By: HispanicPundit</title>
		<link>http://loteriachicana.net/2009/11/19/what-once-was/comment-page-1#comment-73946</link>
		<dc:creator>HispanicPundit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 18:54:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://loteriachicana.net/?p=1292#comment-73946</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve often said in political discussions with friends that the real debate between conservatives and liberals is not whether &lt;em&gt;the poor&lt;/em&gt; deserve government assistance, it is whether &lt;em&gt;the rich&lt;/em&gt; deserve government assistance. Some Republicans here and there may disagree with giving government assistance to the poor in education and even health care, but they are few and far between. The overwhelmingly consensus among Republicans is that the rich, or in general those who can afford it, should pay for services themselves - not the government, through taxation of people who are often times far poorer. Liberals are often in direct opposition, arguing that certain goods should be provided to the rich as well. In other words, ask yourself this question: Should Warren Buffett&#039;s healthcare or education be paid for by government tax revenue? If you answer in the affirmative, you are liberal in political orientation, if you answer in the negative, you are conservative. Everything else is degrees, moderate or radical - but fundamentally, that is the dividing line.

So what would happen if the United States made education free? I could think of only two possibilities: Option A and Option B. Option A being that public schools would then become (over time, of course) subject to political forces and restrictions, getting more funding in certain administrations, less in others, used for political favors, and an overall significant drop in public education quality. Just look at what free education has done to our public schools - especially in their interaction with the poorest citizens. Is that a model we should follow?

Option B is the opposite side of the spectrum (and significantly less likely). Basically public Universities capture enough political favor to increase their funding, political clout, and academic influence. But then who would be paying and who would be gaining? Given the known fact that state taxes tend to be regressive and top public University attendance is largely a benefit for the well off, this option would result in a largely lower middle class paying for the education of the upper middle class and upper class. In other words, the poor paying for the rich to become richer - resulting in larger income inequality.

Sure, some of that free money will &#039;trickle down&#039; to poor students. But even then it&#039;s a small minority that attend college. And of that small minority, a significant portion of those students don&#039;t finish college. And of those that do, another significant portion take majors that get them nowhere. Coming out of UCLA with just a bachelors degree in Chicano Studies, for example, prepares you for a life of...McDonald&#039;s service. All of this, while the upper middle class is largely concentrated in professions that will greatly increase their wealth later in life - doctors, lawyers, engineers - resulting in a huge return for their tax dollars.

So when you compare the winners to the losers...and factor in admittance rate, graduation rate, and life prospects after college  of the poor, and who would end up paying the taxes to fund these Universities,  you get a far different picture. Overall the Warren Buffett&#039;s of the world would be very happy, but the Jose&#039;s and Maria&#039;s would be screwed over.

My stand is obvious: I take &lt;a href=&quot;http://jeffreymiron.blogspot.com/2009/11/higher-tuition-at-university-of.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the typical conservative/libertarian position&lt;/a&gt;: &quot;So California&#039;s tuition increase is a step in the right direction; its universities should mimic elite private universities by setting a high official tuition rate, while discounting that rate for those of limited means. Better yet, California should simply privatize the entire university system.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve often said in political discussions with friends that the real debate between conservatives and liberals is not whether <em>the poor</em> deserve government assistance, it is whether <em>the rich</em> deserve government assistance. Some Republicans here and there may disagree with giving government assistance to the poor in education and even health care, but they are few and far between. The overwhelmingly consensus among Republicans is that the rich, or in general those who can afford it, should pay for services themselves &#8211; not the government, through taxation of people who are often times far poorer. Liberals are often in direct opposition, arguing that certain goods should be provided to the rich as well. In other words, ask yourself this question: Should Warren Buffett&#8217;s healthcare or education be paid for by government tax revenue? If you answer in the affirmative, you are liberal in political orientation, if you answer in the negative, you are conservative. Everything else is degrees, moderate or radical &#8211; but fundamentally, that is the dividing line.</p>
<p>So what would happen if the United States made education free? I could think of only two possibilities: Option A and Option B. Option A being that public schools would then become (over time, of course) subject to political forces and restrictions, getting more funding in certain administrations, less in others, used for political favors, and an overall significant drop in public education quality. Just look at what free education has done to our public schools &#8211; especially in their interaction with the poorest citizens. Is that a model we should follow?</p>
<p>Option B is the opposite side of the spectrum (and significantly less likely). Basically public Universities capture enough political favor to increase their funding, political clout, and academic influence. But then who would be paying and who would be gaining? Given the known fact that state taxes tend to be regressive and top public University attendance is largely a benefit for the well off, this option would result in a largely lower middle class paying for the education of the upper middle class and upper class. In other words, the poor paying for the rich to become richer &#8211; resulting in larger income inequality.</p>
<p>Sure, some of that free money will &#8216;trickle down&#8217; to poor students. But even then it&#8217;s a small minority that attend college. And of that small minority, a significant portion of those students don&#8217;t finish college. And of those that do, another significant portion take majors that get them nowhere. Coming out of UCLA with just a bachelors degree in Chicano Studies, for example, prepares you for a life of&#8230;McDonald&#8217;s service. All of this, while the upper middle class is largely concentrated in professions that will greatly increase their wealth later in life &#8211; doctors, lawyers, engineers &#8211; resulting in a huge return for their tax dollars.</p>
<p>So when you compare the winners to the losers&#8230;and factor in admittance rate, graduation rate, and life prospects after college  of the poor, and who would end up paying the taxes to fund these Universities,  you get a far different picture. Overall the Warren Buffett&#8217;s of the world would be very happy, but the Jose&#8217;s and Maria&#8217;s would be screwed over.</p>
<p>My stand is obvious: I take <a href="http://jeffreymiron.blogspot.com/2009/11/higher-tuition-at-university-of.html" rel="nofollow">the typical conservative/libertarian position</a>: &#8220;So California&#8217;s tuition increase is a step in the right direction; its universities should mimic elite private universities by setting a high official tuition rate, while discounting that rate for those of limited means. Better yet, California should simply privatize the entire university system.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Saldivar</title>
		<link>http://loteriachicana.net/2009/11/19/what-once-was/comment-page-1#comment-73923</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Saldivar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 16:45:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://loteriachicana.net/?p=1292#comment-73923</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the post, prima. Folks were citing the Master Plan and was confused by the reference. As it turns out, the girl who lives above my apartment organized the tent city event. It&#039;s getting pretty hectic over here in Nor. Cal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the post, prima. Folks were citing the Master Plan and was confused by the reference. As it turns out, the girl who lives above my apartment organized the tent city event. It&#8217;s getting pretty hectic over here in Nor. Cal.</p>
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		<title>By: El Random Hero</title>
		<link>http://loteriachicana.net/2009/11/19/what-once-was/comment-page-1#comment-73760</link>
		<dc:creator>El Random Hero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 23:15:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://loteriachicana.net/?p=1292#comment-73760</guid>
		<description>It tripped me out when I read that a while back ago. Higher Education was to create better and educated citizens. Ohh how askew have things gotten since those days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It tripped me out when I read that a while back ago. Higher Education was to create better and educated citizens. Ohh how askew have things gotten since those days.</p>
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